Are we Helix yet?

[luccahuguet]

The definitive meta-discussion to make Helix mode on Zed truly great

Zed contains a nascent community-supported Helix implementation. While the basics should work, there are many features missing, and a significant number of smaller differences between how things work in Helix vs Zed. Zed's team would love to have your help working on these!

The point here is to join forces and capture the users input in the best way possible, listing what already works and what doesn't and bugs we find, so do comment anything you find that is not here yet

What is missing

• vim::PushReplace doesn't work in helix_normal mode #33076
• In helix_normal mode, alt-s doesn't split selection on newlines #31562
• In helix_normal mode, s is incorrectly assigned to vim::Substitute #31561
• In helix_mode, visual mode, alt-; does not invert the anchor of the selection #33838
• Match mode
• Amp mode with gw:
  • Ref 1: https://helix-editor.com/news/release-24-03-highlights/
  • Ref 2: easymotion vim #4930

What needs improvements / bugs

• helix mode: v2w selects one character too many #31997
• In helix_normal mode, alt+C is incorrectly reducing number of cursors #33637
• helix mode: Count + x selects only one row #32020

Enhancements

• Which-Key like menu #10910

Some PRs that already got merged (contributors can use them as inspiration)

• vim: Fix escape key switching back to default mode instead of normal mode #31843
• Implement Helix Support (WIP) #19175
• vim: Add delete action to HelixNormal mode #21544
• Flesh out helix bindings #28103
• Allow specifying no base keymap #9471

Notes

• The idea of a helix mode in Zed is loved by many! See here: Helix keymap #4642
• There is even a total of 300$ in bounties, to be claimed, for advancement on this: https://app.opire.dev/issues/01J6HJZCK02FVD4XG900FY36EE

[dgmulf]

As a veteran Kakoune user (and source code contributer), I would encourage anyone interested in the selection-first modal editing style to study Kakoune itself. Helix still has not caught up to everything that made Kakoune such a beautifully designed and influential piece of software; as such, helix_mode is now an imperfect copy of an imperfect copy.

[1925381584]

Perhaps the difference between good and bad is not simple, it may be a battle of taste, but also a high or low level of realm. At first I used vim and found it very efficient. Later I turned to helix and felt that choosing priority is the new generation paradigm, and finally turned back to vim. I did not deny the advanced concept of helix, but felt that vim was suitable for me.

[adriangalilea]

As a veteran Kakoune user (and source code contributer), I would encourage anyone interested in the selection-first modal editing style to study Kakoune itself. Helix still has not caught up to everything that made Kakoune such a beautifully designed and influential piece of software; as such, helix_mode is now an imperfect copy of an imperfect copy.

I’d be interested in knowing about this, but perhaps this is not the place, link it if you write it.

[bbb651]

This video covers it really well, helix feels like a mishmash of kakoune and vim which makes makes normal and visual mode have a lot of overlap and redundancy (normal mode is "visual lite"), which makes complicates the mental model and makes sequences longer (take this with a grain of salt as I haven't extensively used either, that's the impression I got from the video).

Although I don't think it really matters from Zed's PoV, if enough people are used to helix bindings there's value in support it, ideally both as the core selection extending mechanism is the same, vim is not perfect either and has a lot of quirks yet it certainly objectively the most important to have due to it's familiarity.

[Malix-Labs]

helix feels like a mishmash of kakoune and vim which makes makes normal and visual mode have a lot of overlap and redundancy

Helix has insert, normal, and select mode (Select is akin to Vim's Visual)

But it also is motion-first like Kakoune

Saying Helix normal and visual mode are overlapping and redundant is like saying Vim's hjkl is redundant to MnK's arrows

They have different workflows

if enough people are used to helix bindings there's value in support it

Also maybe there is value in supporting it if they are objectively good and interesting?

Having used Vim, Kakoune, Helix, and Emacs motion each for an extended amount of time, I personally strongly prefer Helix's motions overall, for example

vim is not perfect either and has a lot of quirks yet it certainly objectively the most important to have due to it's familiarity.

To be clear, there was never a debate about removing Vim motions support in Zed

[eugenesvk]

This video covers it really well, helix

That's a bad video.

Didn't get the first complaint, you could also bind Shift+W in helix mode to do the same thing as in kakoune?

And the command length character count is also strange, $ isn't one character, it's Shift hold + 4 of two keys + You have to hold one. And why would that be easier in your head isn't even explained.

Then, failing at specifics, it goes into an even more vague territory of philosophy

[dream-dasher]

Awesome, thanks for making this tracking issue.

1) Can we get some example PRs that added Helix functionality?
I'd be interested in contributing and seeing where other people have actually landed code would be quite useful.

2) Similarly, by what mechanisms does "helix_mode": true,` actually gate code: this would also be helpful in tracking.

3) One of the most useful things about Helix is discoverability -- the visual keymap popups continue the trend of intermediate highlighting -- allowing speed with optional feedback. Has there been any discussion on mechanisms for this? I realize it's probably early, but worth bringing up now as that's a large part of what makes Helix so usable, I think it's fair to say.

[mahalel]

I tried to put up a list of PRs which got merged, from the original issue:

• vim: Fix escape key switching back to default mode instead of normal mode #31843
• Implement Helix Support (WIP) #19175
• vim: Add delete action to HelixNormal mode #21544
• Flesh out helix bindings #28103
• Allow specifying no base keymap #9471

[luccahuguet]

Added to the discussion post (a couple days ago) after reading your comment, thanks

[eliaperantoni]

I filed one more issue #33838 that has to do with visual mode. I also added an extra 100$ to the bounty so it's 300$ now 😊

[luccahuguet]

Awesome! I updated the discussion

[eliaperantoni]

I think a good next step to bridge the gap with Helix would be introducing a new mode: Select (or Helix Visual or Helix Select).

Then we could add some simple features to it to prove that it's worth existing separately from Vim's Visual like:

• In helix_normal mode, alt-s doesn't split selection on newlines #31562
• In helix_mode, visual mode, alt-; does not invert the anchor of the selection #33838

And then later, someone could implement #31561 which seems a bit trickier.

@ConradIrwin would you be open to a new mode that works like this? :)

[Malix-Labs]

I agree about separating Helix's Select from Vim's Visual

Not splitting them could potentially cause issues down the road

[ConradIrwin]

👍 Yup, adding select mode seems sensible to me.

[eliaperantoni]

@ConradIrwin I submitted a PR #34136 🥰

[Dreaming-Codes]

I'm encountering a strange behavior: when I delete a character with d in Helix normal mode, it switches to Vim normal mode. Has this already been reported?

[tibitTW]

Seems matching mode also aren't implemented yet ?

[luccahuguet]

It's in the main post, you might've skipped past it

[tibitTW]

Yeah I skip that indeed

[haxfn]

Why are keybindings just protocols: Why aren't they actually implementations with interfaces. Each new time someone thinks of using a keybinding paradigm in their app, they have to half cook the implementations. Instead the interface should be there to plug, only part left to him should be to wire the interfaces to parts of their app.

[jabcross]

This is just a thought, but one of my favorite features of Helix is the command palette that shows up and shows your options when you're using a sequential keybind:

If you press space:

If you press g:

Dunno how far-fetched it would be to get something like this working in Zed.

[serban]

There is an existing feature request for this: #10910. Give it a thumbs up! 👍☺️

[jabcross]

Neat. Maybe it would make sense to add it to the list of related issues?

[luccahuguet]

neat!! added it

[sa1]

Is a hybrid mode possible? Emacs keymap in the insert mode, and helix otherwise?

[jabcross]

You could certainly remap the keybindings to do that.

[sa1]

Yeah, but tough to figure out the correct context for every keybinding. If someone has an example, that would be great!

[akdor1154]

Classic Hat Guy...

[praguevara]

I've opened #34765 to better match helix's insert and append.

[praguevara]

I feel like yanking with the cursor on top of a single character should only yank that character, and not the whole line. A workaround is to enter visual mode before yanking.

[praguevara]

[fnuttens]

Yes it does, changing text in helix effectively yanks it to " register. Your system clipboard remains unchanged, though.

[praguevara]

You're right. I will delete this then

[mati865]

FYI to replace with clipboard content use R